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All statements are paraphrased from hand written notes and not to be seen
as quotes.
We apologize for any misspelled names.
Alder Ken Golden called the meeting to order and he gave introductory remarks. Golden explained the agenda and said he wanted to follow it closely in order to cover all the material. It is estimated that over three hundred people were in attendance.
Roberts explained the permits needed by Walgreens and standards for approval. He stressed that the city has had these planning rules and regulations in force for a long time. The city has not yet received a proposal from Walgreens.
Roberts reported that the current zoning for the Kopp's site is C1 commercial in the front of the parcel and R2 residential in the rear along Westlawn Avenue. He stated that Walgreens could move into the existing building (about 10,000 square feet) with a little tweaking.
There have been some informal discussions with Walgreens about building a new 14,000 square-foot structure with a drive-through. If Walgreens propose a new 14,000 square foot building on the site, then the following rules and regulations would apply:
The decision of the Plan Commission on the Conditional Use and the Demolition Permit can be appealed to the Common Council, which can overturn or modify the decision on a two/thirds vote.
Roberts concluded his presentation of the city process by explaining again that Walgreens had not made a formal application to the city. He also stressed that it is not proper for the Alders to pre-judge the Walgreens idea before the application is to the city and the proposal is heard in the formal process.
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A conceptual plan was shown that has just an outline of a building and the parking lot and the surrounding streets drawn. Several issues were discussed:
John Kohler and Mike Frame, representing Walgreen's and Semper Development, described the proposal as in the early concept phase with no plan to show. Kohler said they understood that this was a unique site.
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Speaker #1: (Rachael Perlman) I want to see a much smaller store. I have concerns with the parking lot; it should stay the same or be smaller. I want to see bike racks and the storefront up to the street. A lot of people like to walk and bike in this neighborhood. Many people in the Clarendon Apartments need to walk. Keep focus on quality foods. The neighborhood needs good quality food, good milk and not too much candy. I want small signage.
Speaker #2: (Robbie Weber) People like to see something interesting. There should be no blank walls, an obvious door and windows. Parking should be at the back and not take up much of the streetscape. Invest in quality bike racks. They should be located near the store entrance. 10% of the bike racks should be covered for when it rains. People in this neighborhood bike in all types of weather. People want food. Put in fresh food, the kind that people in this neighborhood want to buy. Things like salad, a deli, cheese, humus and household items.
Speaker #3: (Arnold Alanen) Signage. Ken Kopp's is one of the more charming neon signs that are on our street. Night lighting is a concern. The night sky should not be further changes by the types of lights they use. Landscape is important. One of the original plat maps made that lot a park. The city should consider creating more open space.
Speaker #4: (Jacob Perlman) I am wondering about union involvement in the construction of the building and hiring employees. Ans: We use union workers in areas where it is an issue like in Madison.
Speaker #4 continues: Secondly, what we really don't need in Walgreens is a pharmacy. (Huge Applause) Ans: I can't promise that.
Speaker #5: (Karen Cornwell) If there is a new building, I would like to see a pedestrian island like the one at West High and take advantage of the redesign of the parking lot.
Speaker #6: Mary Rouse, Chair of the Board for Regent Market. I have lived in this neighborhood for 28 years and have been the on the Board of the Regent Market for a little less than one year. Regent Market would have closed December 31 but 400 elves donated $56,000. Regent Market is open and excited to discuss the possibility of moving to the Ken Kopp's site. It seems irrational that a small store can stay open except for the grit and determination of those in the neighborhood. People want to walk and bike to their neighborhood institutions.
Speaker #7: Jules Stroick Instead of one large building, make 2 or 3 small 2-3 story buildings. Explore underground parking.
Alder Golden: Golden called names of people from the registration slips wishing to voice their concerns about the Walgreens proposal. He stated that he was grouping many of the registration slips together that were stating the same opinion in order to save time and be able to get through the long agenda. (Note: At a more formal public hearing in front of the Plan Commission, Common Council or any other city committee, anyone registering would be allowed to speak.)
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Speaker #2 (Don Backie of Roundy Foods): Ken Kopp did not call Walgreens, I did. This is Ken Kopp's retirement. Why not let him sell his store and retire. We had a remodeling estimate done. It will take $825,000 just to bring the current store up to code.
Speaker #3 (Chris Hafner): Concern with chain store. The quality of life comes from the owner of stores have a commitment to the neighborhood. How does Walgreens contribute to the neighborhood? Ans: The majority of people employed come from the neighborhood. We support little league. We participate with local business associations. We have brown bags gatherings where people can bring in all their prescriptions and medicines and we help inform them about any possible drug interactions.
Speaker #4 (Brad Ricker): The heavy traffic on Monroe Street may have attracted Walgreens. We in the neighborhood detest the increase in traffic. We do whatever we can to hamper that traffic and will continue to do so. We take pride in stopping traffic by the yield sign. Take that into account.
Speaker #5 (Susan Friedman): I have lived in this neighborhood since 1970. I am opposed to a Walgreens in this neighborhood. Neuhauser is the heart of Monroe Street. The pharmacists know our names, the pills we take, and the sicknesses we have. Walgreens is participating in a nationwide attempt to destroy small businesses.
Speaker #6 (Lisa Hunter): Regardless of how this is resolved, I want to thank Ken (Kopp) for his long service to our neighborhood.
Ald. Ken Golden comments: People need to have discipline in understanding that energy needs to be focused on those issues that are relevant to the standards for permits and zoning issued by the City Plan Commission and the Common Council. If they meet those standards, they will get approval. If they don't, they won't get approval. They will determine that using what they read, staff analysis and what they hear at public meetings.
There has been outreach to 22 grocery companies. We have talked to the Neighborhood Associations, Business Associations and local entrepreneurs. We contacted 8 neighborhood grocery stores in the Madison area, 4 suppliers, a couple developers, 8 chain stores, 7 limited market stores (businesses like food delis). There are about 6 interested parties at this time. Go to the rest of Mike's discussion.
Speaker #1 (Cameron Ramsey, owner of former Madison Sourdough): Cameron thanked Ken Kopp. He described his vision of a shared food mall with other vendors, maybe including John Taylor of Atlas Pasta, Elizabeth Garcia-Hall of Ovens of Brittany, and Peter Robinson of RJ Pasta. This would compliment a small grocery or coop on the Ken Kopp's property. The money you spend in my store stays in the community. Many local artisans, not just food artisans, are willing to take the risk and make life style changes to make this work. With the help of the community, we could make this work, if Ken Kopp is willing to cut us some slack on the time line.
Ald. Ken Golden Sometimes ideas come from someone stating ideas that may seem improbable. One idea I put out was for the neighborhood to buy the site. This would be a real financial burden. But it interacts with the idea that the neighborhoods may need to pony up and invest in the neighborhood. There is a city parking lot next to the Ken Kopp site. It provides parking for the stores and is well used. But parking lots are also owned by the city as land banks; a profitable way for the city to own land in case a better idea comes up later. There is a chance for a whole block solution. We would hope that the parking could go underground. That would make more square feet available for the building. I received a call from a woman willing to commit $100,000 to the Monroe Street Library. She has said that if expanding the library can be combined with the Ken Kopp site issue that is fine with her. The money is tied to the Library. I met with the Library Board. They are overwhelmed with the generosity. They have heard of the tie-in and it may not affect the Ken Kopp site. Chair of the Library Board said they would put together some conceptual schemes using the same hours and other variables as the present library. It is a reach. Senior development is being researched. The redevelopment would be mitigated by the use of the current library and adjacent city lot since they are owned by the library and city.
Speaker #2: (Orange Schroeder of Orange Tree Imports): Orange spoke about the businesses on Monroe Street. She emphasized that she was speaking for herself and not the Monroe Street Business Association. She thanked Amy Gilliland for she generous donation and the outpouring of support for the local businesses. We would rather not lose locally owned Neuhauser to a chain if we have a choice. Ken Kopp is one of those local businesses and he has been very active. Ken has the right to retire. We need a solution that is equitable to Ken and serves the neighborhood. A developer building a two to three stories with housing above and a food service business on the main floor with underground parking would be my favorite.
Speaker #3: Another speaker pointed out that women sometimes do not want to use underground parking for safety reasons, especially at night.
He said the local grocers are reporting to him that they are barely making it. They said the Kopp's location is great. He stated that he had not talked to Mr. Kopp directly. On the positive side, it is on the right side of the road going home at night and the neighborhood is an asset. On the negative side, the grocer business is difficult. The business needs $105,000 sales/week (@5 million / year) and 3-4000 shoppers. Labor will cost about 4 times the rent of the space. The meat market has the biggest profit margin. Financing will be difficult. It would cost $500,000-$750,000 to build new, inventory will cost $400,000 to $500,000 and it would require 20% equity from the bank to finance (that would be millions of dollars). The building would need to be 10,000 Square Feet minimum to be viable. Hours would need to be 7 days a week and open evenings. The new operator would need to apply for certification and relicensing and there is a liquor license issue that will need to be addressed. Neighborhood grocers are on the defensive, trying to keep their territory rather than venturing into new territory.
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Speaker #1 (Steve P. Owner of Paragon Video): Steve said that this decision needs to be done quickly. An empty store would not be good for the neighborhood and the businesses. I have invested about 2 million in Monroe Street with remodeling my building and the inventory.
Speaker #2: Will Walgreens will back off? Ans:We (Walgreens representatives) are here to listen. We have not submitted a proposal yet.
Speaker #3: A Monroe Street resident also representing 1000 Friends of Wisconsin, a land use advocacy and education business spoke about the issue. This process, the idea of giving input is a very good idea and we need to insist on involvement of how the site looks. New Urbanist theory should not be an anomaly; the city should always consider it. Entrepreneurs are wanted. We need to be able to walk or bike to a grocery store. We need to be open to ideas like the food artisan plan. If choice is Walgreens or grocery chain we need to consider the options. One option is Trader Joe's a chain food store started in California that specializes in quality food. It has been in California for many years and has a local neighborhood flavor. It is still family owned and is always locally managed. The website is: www.traderjoes.com. Their phone number is 781-433-0234; ask to talk to Margaret McDonald if you are interested in that option. We need to respect the merchants on Monroe Street and Ken's need to retire.
Speaker #4: I understand that the city cannot open a grocery store, but investments from neighborhoods could be used to help city buy and develop property. I consider Monroe Street to be part of the value of my home. It is part of the reason I moved here. How do we plan for the alternative and pay Ken Kopp when the time lines may be different? We need to separate the issues so Ken Kopp can be protected and meet the offer.
Speaker #5: I live off of Monroe Street. I think this is a simple issue. The simple issue is about the quality of life. We don't need more pharmacies. The solution is not to shell out money. We need an entrepreneur to have access to our unified commitment to local businesses. Walgreens, like Wal-Mart, come in and move out local businesses. We don't need more drug sellers in the neighborhood. We need a way to communicate what we are willing to buy to entrepreneurs so they have assurance that we will support them.
Speaker #6: (Steve, owner of Jenifer Street Market): I hope the City of Madison buys your store and matches Walgreen's offer. I do have finances I can commit but the city can lease and offer sub-lease rates to a grocery store like the Triangle Market. I can put $750,000 towards this project if I see commitment needed to make it work. It does take commitment and people do need to use MOST of their food dollars in that store to make it work. It will take more money, a lot more money.
Speaker #7: This is a 2-track process. While we look for commitments to an alternative, they are going to go ahead. We need a lawyer from the neighborhood willing to do some pro bono work with the neighborhood associations to make sure that we are there at every step of the way. Please follow two tracks: 1) positive 2) defensive. Orange Schroeder commented: There is a Vilas Neighborhood resident that has committed to pay for legal services.
Speaker #8: I have heard statements in the press that this is a done deal. But in the Oct 3, 2000 issue of Business News, regarding a proposed Walgreens in Ohio, a spokesperson of Walgreens is quoted, "Walgreens scouts 1000s of sites and if there is objection from the city or local residents we move on to the next site."
Speaker #9 (Amy Gilliland, donor of $100,000 to Monroe St. Library): The library is a place where people of all classes and ages can come to gather and share. I have been in the neighborhood 4-5 years. We need a place for teens that is not oriented around spending money. There is not enough room at the library to spread out. If we make the library bigger, then I believe people will come. In junior high, it made a big difference in my life to have a place that was safe to go.
Speaker #10 (Mary Rouse, Chair of Board of Regent Market Co-Op): Thank you, Amy. Looking at Ken Kopp's, we have to have shoppers. We need a commitment to buy all groceries and not treat the store like a convenience store. Regent St. Market Co-Op members were willing to pay $100 and pay more for groceries so that it can compete with the large chains. We need long-term commitment to make this work.
Speaker #11 (Ann Clark): Ken Kopp's is not making enough weekly. We need to shop Ken Kopp's now. Use comment card to state what would you use more of all the alternatives suggested tonight.
Speaker #12:Has the offer from Walgreens been accepted? Ans:The offer is accepted subject to contingencies. Speaker #13:What is the amount of the offer? Ans:The amount of the offer is Ken Kopp's private business and he has a right to his privacy.
The neighborhood associations will coordinate pledges and volunteers to work on alternatives.
I love these kinds of neighborhoods. There is a balancing act in these neighborhoods. There may be a contract and the may be an application that comes forward. We will give any proposal a rigorous look. The Community Development Authority does own Asian Midway Foods but the City is not making much money from it. What kind of things might the City do if we look at alternatives? Neighborhood associations are made up of volunteers, but City staff can look into these alternatives. Planning department can give research time to help make informed decisions. A conflict with an existing business is something we would look at from an economic development standpoint. Even with an accepted offer, there are many proposals that never make it to the stage of getting zoning or to the Common Council.
Question: What is the time line on the zoning process? Ans: A rezoning can take about 6-8 weeks for review and hearing. A PUD can take up to 6 months for approval.
Question: How many families in the three neighborhoods? Ans: There are about 6500 families.
Described in Appendix 2.
Speaker #1:This is a neighborhood that does not want Walgreen's. This will give you trouble, trouble, trouble and be bad for your reputation.
Jane Riley, DMNA President: We support exploring the alternatives and we will use the DMNA website to post updates on this issue.
The zoning code requires one parking space for each 300 square feet of gross floor area for new retail stores including grocery stores, drug stores, etc. A proposed 14,000 square foot building would require 47 parking stalls. If there is not enough room on the site to accommodate 47 stalls, the applicant may request a parking variance for fewer stalls. The following criteria for approval would apply:
Standards for Variance. The Zoning Board of appeals shall not vary the regulations of this ordinance, as authorized, unless it shall make findings based upon the evidence presented to it in each specific case that all of the following conditions are present:
If the applicant decides to apply to rezone the site from its present zoning of R2 Residential and C1 Commercial to Planned Unit Development (PUD) zoning, the following criteria for approval applies:
Planned Unit Development District (PUD)
Statement of Purpose. The Planned Unit Development District is established to provide a voluntary regulatory framework designed to encourage and promote improved environmental and aesthetic design in the City of Madison by allowing for greater freedom, imagination and flexibility in the development of land while insuring substantial compliance to the basic intent of the zoning code and the general plan for community development. To this intent, it allows diversification and variation in the bulk and relationship of uses, structures and spaces in developments conceived as comprehensive and cohesive unified plans and projects. It is further intended to encourage developments consistent with coordinated area site planning.
Criteria for Approval. As a basis for determining the acceptability of a Planned Unit Development District application, the following criteria shall be applied with specific consideration as to whether or not it is consistent with the spirit and intent of this ordinance and has the potential for producing significant community benefits in terms of environmental and aesthetic design.
First the site would need to be rezoned by the Common Council from its existing zoning of R2 Residential and C1 Commercial to a "higher" commercial zoning, C2 that would allow the drive-up pharmacy service window. The C2 zoning would allow the drive-up window as a "conditional use", that requires Plan Commission approval.
The zoning code states that: "No application for a conditional use shall be granted by the City Plan Commission unless such Commission shall find all of the following conditions are present:
Any proposal to demolish a building that is in reasonably good condition requires Plan Commission approval. The purpose of this regulation and the demolition permit standards contained in the ordinance read as follows:
Statement of Purpose. It is hereby a matter of public policy that the good maintenance and rehabilitation of existing buildings, the preservation of safe and sanitary housing available at reasonable prices, and the careful consideration and planning of changes in the urban landscape are a public necessity and are required in the interest of the health, prosperity, safety, and welfare of the people. The purpose of this section is to:
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